in spite of it all, amazing stuff has emerged recession has helped raise awareness of the value of data (see nanog 2002-2003 meetings, nanog.org videoarchives) DNS: damage in the DNS system BGP: route dampening considered harmful (again) behavior under stress (lixia et al) non-deterministic routing can be demonstrated w/in full mesh topology enhancements to prevent persistent route oscillations partial order (due to MED) in route selection MEDs prevent reasoning about routing policies though existing references encourage use of MEDs to influence inbound policies how much are we facing limitations of distance vector protocol and inherent limitations of same lots more examples upshot: environment more receptive to collaboration than ever